PSE is making an arrow called the Black Mamba that is incredible.Carbon shaft with an vinyl insert tube,it also has a steel insert w/a steel over cap to protect the shaft.I'll try an get a web-site or a picture.I have a dozen now if anybody want to mess w/a couple.I'll post the weights after I fletch one up.

sounds great

The 32" shaft with insert,nock,and over cap weigh in at 738 grains.The Black Mamba is available in the 400 size which is the stiffest.But the components will work in the other shaft sizes.If any one is shooting the 400 size and wants to mess with one get in touch with me.

Also I've been in touch with the guy that is charge of this arrow to find out more about it.So I will try an update as I find out.

What's the deflection?  How stiff is it or for what weight bow/point is it rated.  I have to find out if I can actually shoot it out of my bows before I go blowing up a perfectly good arrow.  Thanks.

"Carbon Force-Radial X Weave-Black Mamba"
400 series shaft
0.337 spine
9.2 grains per inch
12.0 grains per inch vinyl KE tube

I'd be interested to see what the stainless components weigh. It's not as heavy as the Carbon Express Terminator Hunters and only marginally stiffer.

The stainless insert weighs in at 44 grains and the over cap is 8.4 grains.

Also the vinyl tube fits the shaft perfectly,so its a pretty sound system.

Is the inside diameter of the arrow "standard", meaning, can the 12gr/in vinyl tube be used in other carbons? And by fits perfectly, do you mean it's quieter than the other tubes on the market? Where does the over cap go on the arrow?  Is the tube flexible enough to not adversely effect static spine? Thanks for the help Ed!

Yes,I have put the tube in other arrows such as Carbon Express,Vapor and Easton.The over cap goes over the insert end of the arrow in between the insert and point.And yes the vinyl tube is flexible. JC shoot me a PM with your address I'll ship one to ya

Big Ed,  They sound like a good arrow but with that weight and spine, I would just go with the Beeman Max4's.  Their heavy hitter is a .300 deflection, 12.5 grains per inch dart with the HIT system (making it very thin) and a durable finish.  If that's too heavy, they have a 11.2 gpi .340 deflection Max4, or the Black Max with 10.4 @ .340 and 11.7 @ .300.  That way I don't have to even mess with a tube or two part insert/ over cap.  I would love to see how those Black Mambas work out in the future, because they sound like a great idea.  They just need to make one a bit heavier and stronger.

I would probably say the terminator 45-60 camo with a 3grn per weight tube.Or even installing some weight to your Gold Tips with their weight system or Game tracker weight tubes.

I've been testing these into some cinder blocks and other things, and they are holding up much better than alot of the others.

Anybody tried the GrizzlyStiks?  They are a heavy shaft, three different weights, Sitka 430 to 530 grs, Safari 550 to 650 grs, and Safari 650 to 850 grs.  For details, go to  http://www.alaskabowhunting.com/default.php?cPath=22

Bill

A little to salty for me.

I bought some aquarium tubing today and I will see what that does for weight.

dale

I tried all the plastic/rubber tubing, weedwacker line etc. years ago and didn't like any of it. Any of that stuff that adds weight without adding any spine to the full length of the shaft will reduce the dynamic spine of the shaft and shooting heavy bows and such, getting enough spine in a small diameter shaft is a problem. I tested out a lot of things, including quite a few shafts for Ed at Alaska Bowhunting, coming up with a practical heavy small diameter shaft is NOT an easy thing.

Rick,shoot me your mailing address I'll mail you one if you want to check it out.

I just did some math, my 30" arrows w/ 145 grain BH would be around 570 grains total (Max4 .300).  If you really wanted more weight you could add lead solder to the inside:-)  I heard of one guy that got 1300-1400 grains with his Axis 300's, and they are lighter then the Beeman versions.