If you've read my pow wow post, you'll now that my dream is to fell an elephant with bow and arrow in hand. However, the one animal is find more entreaging, exotic, and overlooked,is the white rhino. Has anyone ever bowhunted one here. I believe Ted Nugent did, but does any know someone who took one with a bow. It was mentioned that Howard Hill took one, but I saw nothing about it in his game list (on Craig Ekins website). Please tell me the #lbs. of the bow, and the arrows and broadheads used. I must know. Thank you.
Chris
I dont know about white rhino, due to the conservation status I believe there is not any possiblility of hunting them outside of a real small pen. (I believe Capstick discusses this in one of his books, if you are interested in Africa then Peter Capstick is required reading!) Black rhinos can still be hunted in some circumstances, if youve got the $$$. I know I've seen a few pictures recently with compound bows and rhinos, the fuzzy question is always whether a rifle was used for backup. I think you are really on the edge of the capability of archery equipment on rhino.
Negley from Texas killed one (or two?) back when he was shooting all his African stuff. If you ever get to San Antonio TX go to the Buckhorn Saloon, his mounts are there. They were showing the old movies of his rhino and elephant hunts there. I think he missed the first rhino he shot at completely--like Monty Browning says: "Its hard to shoot when you're having a heart attack!"
I'm sure Swinehart killed one (if you can get ahold of the book "Sagittarius" it is a good read on bowhunting the Big Five in the last days of Old Africa).
I dont know about Hill (I'm no Hill expert) but I know Pope and Young had special arrows made to hunt rhino but I dont know the outcome of that endeavor.
I'm sure guys on here could tell you about some other traditional rhino kills.
Ryan
It is considered by some as a prehistoric hold-over and is in fact one of the oldest mammals roaming the planet today. He appears awkward and docile at first glance but is very short tempered and quick to charge. It has been said " the rhino is the easiest of the Big Five to find and shoot". This has been it's demise and both species the white and black are dangerously low in numbers but in managed areas, some permits for white rhino are available.
Due to the availability of rhino permits being primarily for game ranches, the size of the animal and the easy to follow three toed track, he is easily located.
-Got This info off bowhuntingsafari.com. And, looking at a collection of bow-killed rhino, you'll notice the majority have the humped-back, square head, and square lips of the white rhino. Heck, they're only called white rhinos because Europeans thought the name African natives called it (meant broad lipped one, or something of the like) sounded like white.
Seems to me I recall Monty Browning writing about shooting one with his longbow in PBS magazine.
Chris
You're right about the name origin being non-english. The Boers (German immigrants who spoke Afrikaans) referred to them with the Afrikaans word for "wide" referring to the lip and that was translated "white" by English speakers.
White rhinos are generally considered quite unoffensive as compared to the black, or prehensile lipped, ones. I have read that this may be due to the fact that white (square lipped) rhinos are grazers and usually found in more open territory than the browsing black rhino that spends more time in thick cover. Maybe the black ones are meaner from eating acacia bush?! I would be.
I wont say too much about something I havent done, but "managed areas" and "game ranches" might be a tip off. ;)
Ryan
Yeah, I get what your saying Ryan. Hey, just think. The white rhino is 2-3 times heavier than the black rhinos with a longer horn. May the Good Lord have mercy on the bowhunter who sticks an already pissed off white.
But I would still like to know of any who have bowkilled rhino and the gear they used. Im a dreamer, and one day I hope to claim Africa's Big Six with a trad bow (though maybe switching to a compound wouldn't be a sin for a pachyderm). Course, in the words of my dads favorite motto: "Maybe you should try for a whitetail first... and get a job!!! :bigsmyl:
Chris
Its not bad to be a dreamer. From my African library (much of which I purchased when I was in high school) I always wanted to hunt Cape Buff. Then I read White and Edison Marshall and got turned onto the old days in Asia, and the wild cattle they hunted there-Guar(Saladang), Banteng, wild buffalo. I read Monty's story several years back in TBM about water buff in Australia and one thing led to another and now I'm going to Australia next year for buffalo with my recurve. I hope to bring home one of those big ugly things at the top of this page (not Cory!).
Dream on-you never know what may happen!!
Ryan
I know this is probably a stupid question,
(Stupid Computer) Sorry bout that, but what I meant to say is I know this is probably a stupid question, but are you "the" Rothaar? (Rothaar Snuffers) Probably not but hey, Im still a kid. I can ask stupid questions.
Dont know about "the" Rothhaar...but I'm "a" Rothhaar.
Dad is "the" Rothhaar. I'm "the boy" as I'm generally refferred to. I DID spend alot of my misspent youth putting Snuffers together, though. Heck I'm still a kid too, just turned 30 in March! Now I get to put Dad's treestands up for him, I'm heading out to Iowa this weekend for just that. I've learned that if I pay attention I can pick up a thing or two, though :)
Ryan
Wow!!!! I'll get back to rhinos, but let me just use this chance to say that this site and the web all together! I have used Razorheads for the past 4 years due to the fact that they were all that was available. But when given the chance, I have now decided to use your fathers original Snuffers. Great broadheads, and I hope to claim my first deer with them. Wow!!!! It's an honor to meet you and hear of your father. Okay, back to rhinos.
Its not traditional but I discovered a bowkilled rhino+info on tackle and gear. The mans name is Rick Hunt. He used a Mathews Safari Grade 100lb. compound bow, Vapor 4000 860-grain double shafted carbon arrows, and Steel Force 210-grain, 2-blade broadheads. His 1st arrow penetrated 25-1/2 inches deep (the kill shot), and was requested to make another, which penetrated 13 inches deep, including through the shoulder bone. But again, I would love to hear from any with info on a trad bowkilled rhino.
German immigrants?! Combination of Dutch and French actually.
"Wyd" (pronounced 'vate') sounds like "wit" (pr. 'vitt')
Adrian de Villiers shot one about 10 years ago with a compound, but it was a bad shot and the rhino was finished off with a gun.
Thats interesting. All I could find for shooters on the web was Negley (didn't show gear used), Hunt, and Bogner(didn't show gear used). The person to check out would probably be Tink Nathan. I know he has bow killed rhino before, though I am not sure whether he used trad gear or not. Although, 2 of his 3 elephants were downed with a Howatt recurve bow
G'day Ryan " a" Rothhaar :wavey:
Monty Browning shot a White Rhino in 1985 I believe. He used a 90# longbow and a 1500gr solid fiberglass fish arrow with a Hunters Head broadhead. The thing for rhino hunting now is called agreen hunt. The rhino is shot with an arrow that has a tranquilizer dart on the end of it instead of a broadhead. You get your picture taken with it and the Wildlife people get to do whatever they need to then it gets the antidote and goes on his way. Right now I think this is the only option for rhino hunting because I don't think you can bring any parts(cape& horns)into the country. It is also cheaper than killing one which the last I heard was about $30,000.00. It still isn't cheap though I don't know how much. Joseph
D@#% it all! I mean, I really wish to take a rhino some day. However, I've seen the numbers of rhino pop., and they're not to good. I don't think I would honestly bowhunt something as endangered as them. It all comes down to ethics. But this is just another example of how poachers can ruin the expieriance of a hunt.
Hey, if there were ever someone on this site who knew something on bowhunting rhinoceros first hand, wouldn't Dr. Ashbey be it. I mean, didn't he take a rhino before, or am I wrong?
Thanks to all who replied. I am very greatful. Now I know that at least 3 trad bowhunter have taken rhino, and two of which, I now have gear used for their hunt. This is all useful info, and even though the white and black rhinoceros may not be huntable at this time; hey, Im 16, and have year to go. And with all these replies, the dream will surely be kept alive. :) :)
P.S.- To Negley, Ashbey, Browning,and other who have taken rhino, I say: :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :notworthy:
Yep, H. Hill did take a rhino according to Craig Ekins and he used the same 1700gr arrow and 260gr broadhead 110lb longbow. But.... a guide shot the critter after it took a turn toward Hill. Hill would not take credit for the kill even though the arrow hit the vitals and the bullet didnot.
BTW Craig is building a limited run of the 260gr hill "Elephant Broadheads" they look wicked... ;)
I was on the Dries Visser web site and the cost of a 3 day green rhino hunt is $6950.00. Seems kind of steep to me to Marlin Perkins a rhino and have your picture taken with it. Joseph
Windknot:
I reckon you are right on that one. Its a funny thing, in the U.S. there is real confusion over our own immigrations-there are a couple of so called "Dutch migrations" in our history (one of which my family is from) which have generally much more to do with Germany than the Netherlands. I usually assume-bad habit!- "Dutch" means "German" when comparing it to US history.
Al- I put away the buffalo bow for now...smaller critters in the near future, I dont need to shoot through 3 antelope with one arrow!
Keep us updated on the doings up at Bullo River with the buffs!!
Gday, mate!
Ryan
JRH:
Hill never ceases to amaze me. 3 elephants and a rhino. Unbelievable. That 260 grain Howard Hill looks like a great head, and a replica of perhaps one of the greatest broadheads in archery history. After sending $20.00 for one, I hope its a good head.
Once again, thanks for the rhino info from you and everyone else. Man, the amount of info on this site still amazes me.
The rino that Monty shot was a "nuisance" animal that had to be removed. It may be viewed in the S.
C. Natural History Museum today in his full magnificent.
TTT
There ya go Rich.
Gotta click 'show all topics' on the top right page of the forum.
Thanks Bowspirit, for posting this one back.
Great info,
Rich
The exploits of hunts usually being exaggerated by friends , I am glad I can make a statement before any of my friends read this , I have had The experiance to arrow a black rhino One that I will not repeat . For personal reasons . I was on a several thousand acre mangaged game area .
My friend had made a poor shot with his mathews safari and really got the animal angry , I had to draw on it and was lucky to get a halfway decent shot , they move remarkably fast ! and as my arrow disappeared , the beast turned and ran 25 yards and fell dead .
My friend has refused to hunt without me to this day , and has continued to constantly brag of the prowess and heroism !
All I can say is ARE YOU NUTS!!!! I was scared out of my wits and thought I was next after it trampled you !!!!!
I will never willingly take rhino or elephant species ever again , I do however wish to add Cape buffalo to my list .
My tackle consists of 147# Damon howatt ventura , and laminated shaft in shaft carbons with 160 gr broadhead .
#147!!!!!! :notworthy:
Varbogen,
just curious, any way you could post a picture of that bow? i bought a very old Damon Howatt recurve from a yard sale. its very worn, but, i believe it is a ventura. thanks
Bob Swinehart One of Howard Hills students went to Africa in the 1960's. He shot a record I believe Black Rhino. It is at the Smithsonian. The article I read in the old LOngbow Digest in the late 1970's said it had been taken off display and was downstairs. Someone let the author down and he had a photo of it. My digests are buried in storage or I would copy it and get it in here for you guys. Since the smithsonian rotates it's exhibits it could be on display now.
Hacksaw
Horace Worcester
Wow Hacksaw...that'd be something to see!!! I remember when I was looking up this topic I came across a picture of Swinehart posing with his rhino. It should be somewhere on this site...
The story of Swinehart's Black Rhino is covered on p.195-205 in his book Sagittarius. Also mentioned there that it was accepted for display by the Smithsonian.
He shot a 90# bamboo LB with 1200gr Micro-Flite glas arrow and HH bhd. The arrow penetrated into the lung on the far side.
Also covered in "The Trophy Hunters" by Col Allison.
I also have a copy of an old Outdoor Life with Swineheart's africa adventure. If you'd like I will send you a copy when I get home as I'm out of state right now.
I understand that Monte's rhino had to be rifled as his arrows hadn't arrived and he only had one arrow to hunt wit, one that he had left with the PH on an earlier trip.
147#'s!!!!!! Good grief that is one heavy bow. I think I juts dislocated my shoulder thing about pulling it back. You my friend must be a BEAST of a man. LOL I would hate to meet you in a dark alley.
Dr. Ed Asby killed a 6000 lb(approx.)white rhino in 1984. Shot it with a 115 lb longbow and a 1286 gr arrow. Have a picture of him with the rhino in my office.
I always wondered what Dr. Ashby took his white rhino with...very interesting.
I have written to the smithsonian to see if I can obtain a photo of Bob Swineharts Black Rhino Display.
I will be glad to share it if they send one.
Hacksaw
QuoteOriginally posted by Bowspirit:
I always wondered what Dr. Ashby took his white rhino with...very interesting.
If my memory is correct he told me he used a 115-117 pound pull long bow for it.
Steve Kobrine shot a White Rhino with a Black Widow in the mid Ninties, and Robert Eastman took a Black Rhino in the Seventies with a recurve
I saw a clip of a video with Dale Karch about to shoot one,I dont know if he did or not.He had a longbow in hand.I think it was on a Bowhunter Tv trailer.I rece3ntly received an e mail from an outfitter who was advertising a black rhino hunt for the low price of 275,000.00 not including board!!!!!!! :scared:
that might be the threerivers "africa" video you are mentioning.. they came across those rhino while on a hunt for something else (I forget), but they were not there to hunt rhino, and just observed them.
It's a cool video, but no rhino hunting on it.
(Denny Sturgis is in it, too)
I believe the rhino in the video were at Melorani. We hunted there last year and three rhinos visited my friend's wife in her thatch blind. At one point she had three rhino horns in her blind as they were sniffing around through the shooting windows! A couple rubbed up against the blind, one at the exit so she wasn't able to get out. To say she was shook up would be an understatement!!! If I'd been in the blind I would've soiled myself! From that point on she only hunted in elevated blinds.
I've read many books on hunting Africa and I can't recall a single one saying the Rhino was anything more then a big target like a steer. Sure they can run you down but it's low on the list of big 5 when it comes to being dangerous. That's one animal I'd be more then glad to take a picture of then kill.
147!! 115!! I think I've read about the true Hercules! Wow, I'm happy with getting 60# back thoughout the day!
Paul, does that apply just for these modern days, or did it apply back in the 60s and 70s as well? Like, does that apply to Bear and Hill and Negley and Swinehart and Ashby and Easton and Browning? And, it could be suggested that the least egotistical bowhunter would be the one who doesn't know that internet forums exist, let alone spend time on one (especially when it comes to sharing success stories and photos). Because I'm so new to bowhunting, and have no African experience whatsoever, I feel I do not have the right or experience to comment on what dreams a fellow should or shouldn't have, or what motivates another person.
Anyway, the reds must be about to start roaring in NZ (they roar in April down south in Australia)! All the best if you're heading out after them!
I'm looking for buffalo tomorrow!
Cheers, Ben
Paul,
are you saying don't feed people facing starvation?
are you actually saying that there are people who are "UNNECESSARY, even though generally their situation is an accident of birthplace"? it is always very easy as affluent westerners to throw judgement at those less fortunate than us
Whilst the worlds over population is an ever increasing concern, to suggest such as you have
defies any sense of compassion or empathy.
i have worked for many years in communities that would be considered third world..
i find this a very saddening and offensive post
Paul with the greatest respect for your hunting ability you are way off the mark with this. Do the names Adolph Hitler, Heinrich Himmler, Joseph Stalin, Mao Tse Dung, Pol Pot, Idi Amin, Robert Mugabe etc etc mean nothing to you? I am with bmlongshot on this, your life and most of your prospects in this world are heavily dependant on the accident of your birthplace. Numbers of people is only one measure of whether your existence is 'neccessary', how about your ecological footprint? The whole of Africa produces less than 3% of greenhouse gasses yet the USA alone with just 6% of global population churns out 25%. And this is OK? Of course subsistance farming wrecks the environment but if you fail to give people the chance to grow skills and productive ability what do they do? China has radically dropped its birthrate through hideous social engineering but the result is that many young Chinese are after money and economic power first. Similar things are happening in SA, the urban black population birthrate is a fraction of the rural one, economic opportunity means far greater wealth with a smaller family. It's not a simple numbers thing AT ALL. And I have also worked in aid projects and rural development as well as conservation, now I am a financial planner.
chrisg
I for one love this thread...heck, that's why I started it. But if it goes on like this, I kinda think one of our moderators should wrap it up...it's about the mighty rhinoceros and those few traditional archers brave (or foolish, however you may see it) to take them with bow and arrow. No more, no less...
This is a wonderful site and there are myriad examples of fine actions and decent attitudes by people here. Respect and compassion are core threads. It is sad and worrying that respect for others and their lives and struggles appears limited to your own.
chrisg
Don't worry Terry I did it myself. Sorry my response to an off topic post was also off topic. Good luck
chrisg
Got rid of the vial sick garbage....will clean it up a bit more later.....gotta run now.....
Thanks Terry! Little off topic from Rhino's.
BTW....what I said above only refered to one individual...even though removed a few more member's posts it was only to make the thread less confusing with the main problem posts missing.
Awright....won't do it again. :(
Thanks for that Terry! It was a little more than slighlty off topic! :D
Well now Chris.....Maybe, You could find a "domestic" Rhino..... ;)
(inside joke among friends) :biglaugh:
Nah! They all taste the same.
You could do a 'green hunt' darting one for science, get your hero pic, measurements etc and then the vet will give the guy an antidote and he goes off with wierd memories of alien abduction...and you with your pic.
:biglaugh:
chrisg
You shoot one domestic turkey... :knothead: :banghead:
Anyway, I wanna thank everyone whos posted info here so far on rhinos taken with a bow. To me, rhinoceros are, well, simply amazing. An unreachable dream...but amazing, none the less...
I think that once you have viewed a Rhino in its natural environment, you will not be capable of fulfilling your dream that you believe you have. It's a lot different than shooting antelope or the like. They are best left where they are, alive.
Dont know if it has been mentioned because I didnt have time to read through all 4 pages but there is one alternative that might be appealing. Jim Shockey had a hunt where they shot a tranquilizing arrow from his bow into a rhino at like 6 yards. It doesn't kill the animal and lets the people get the info they need from the animal. You still get to stalk and shoot it, you just dont get to take it home. To me that would be good enough, Im not much for needing heads all over tho. Thought I would mention it.
To the original poster, if you want to hunt rhino and it is legal where you plan to do so. More power to you. The governments that control the populations of rhino in their country determine if there are enough to allow limited hunting or not. I personally will not critize anyone who chooses to hunt legally. It is their right to do so.
Let just say, I value and protect my rights, and don't like it when other people try and step on them because they don't like how I practice those rights.
I will say that there are options that are equally challenging to and in somes peoples views better than hunting to kill a rhino in Africa. First would be the tranquilize and study / tagging method mentioned earlier. Personally that is the choice I would make. Costs less, lets the animal live, you can get a replicated trophy, and science gets info. Sounds like a win / win to me.
Another option would be to research and look at a hunt in the US. A big part of the recovery of endangered african game is that US ranches have agreements where they breed and raise various endangered african game on their lands and a certain percentage are returned to Africa to be released. These game ranches offer hunts for a limited number of rhino every year. These animals are not endangered, and many of them roam on huge ranches that can be considered fair chase due to the size of the property.
In my state we get to shoot one deer and one elk a year. Is the guy in Arkansa, or Alabama who can shoot 7 to 100 deer a year unethical. NOPE! His states game laws say you can shoot that many. What about hunting wood chuck on the east coast versus Idaho wolves? Not a bit of difference in my book. Each State says theres enough to hunt. Each State says its legal.
Lots of people are wound up about hunting the wolves in Idaho. Frankly it is none of their business. Unless of course they live in Idaho. Idaho Citizens can vote and impact the states decisions thru their vote, attend meetings, voice their opinions, etc.... That is our process and that is how it is meant to work.
So I say go for it. Look at all you options, practice hard with a heavy bow. Put together some heavy UEFOC arrows and shoot for the boiler room. And for your own sake, dont hit it in the shoulder blade! A rhino will stomp you into the dirt, making a small reddish mud puddle.
What Gibbo80 says is true. I used to work for a Ecotourism Game Farm in South Africa that offered what they called a green hunt. You shoot the rhino with a tranquiliser, and they get to do the research and stick the microchip in the horn. You get the photos of the hunt and the rhino gets to run away. All in a win-win situation. I believe you wouldn't be able to take the head for mounting, as rhino are a protected species and taking the horn is illegal. When a rhino dies in South Africa, Nature Conservation take the horn, thus the reason for the micro chip. Besides rhino are seriously expensive now, reaching R300k at auction at the game sales now, and not many owners want to part with their prized rhino. I see this post started in 2004, but I know that the white rhino is more plentiful than the black rhino now. Also, the post that says you'll need to shoot a rhino in a cage isn't true. Before you can buy a rhino in southern africa, your farm is inspected by nature conservation and if it's not big enough, you can't buy a rhino, I'm talking over 4000-5000hec. So it won't be a canned hunt. So I don't know if you'll actually get a rhino anymore.
I spoke with Ted Nugent years ago about his Rhino hunt. He used an alum arrow inside another alum arrow and a heavy head. His arrow burried to the fletch at the shot. HOWEVER, what it really did was deflect off a rib bone and tunnel along the animal's side. He said they dispatched it a couple of hard tracking days later with a .375 H&H mag, because once he arrowed it, he was paying for it anyway. They did some test shots after it was dead. The tricky part, according to him, was getting the arrow in between the ribs.
Gary Bogner has killed rhino and the other big six with a bow (compound) .
Yes Gary bogner has killed a rhino with his compound bow and you can watch it on his first african video. The only two guys that I know of that have killed a rhino with a trad bow was Bill Negely with a 100# bear recurve and Dr. Ed Ashby with what I belive wa a 160# longbow he made himself. So it can be done good luck to you.
I've heard that you can also do a cast of the rino horn while it's unconscious (sp)and have a replica made. just like they do with elephants because of difficulty in importing ivory.
Frankly I wouldn't want to do a green hunt like that, I do know someone who has though and he seemed to have fun. I think it crosses a line, in cheesiness where a camera would be better used to take pics of it on its feet. I wouldn't put anyone down for doing it though if thats what trips your trigger go for it.
the chef